by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier
El Gamo 300 was a low-priced, quality breakbarrel from the 1960s and ’70s.
I’m out of the office for the next couple days. Will the veteran readers please help the newer readers with their answers while I’m gone? As always, I’ll see the blog early in the morning and, again, late at night. Thanks! On to today’s report.
This report covers:
• A little more history of the 68-XP
• Velocity testing
• Breech seal
• Retesting velocity
• Cocking effort
• Trigger-pull
• How my life has changed
Today, I’ll test the El Gamo 300 velocity. I see that many of you were surprised to learn these were made in both Spain and Brazil. Furthermore, a number of newer readers had missed the 6-part report on the El Gamo 68-XP and were surprised to see it referenced in Part 1 of this report. Here’s a little more on that subject.
There was a repeating version of the 68-XP that had the same mechanism as the El Gamo Expomatic. It was a tube above the gun that fed pellets into the breech one at a time as the barrel was broken during cocking. It didn’t work too well, and Air Rifle Headquarters refused to carry either repeater. They tested them and found that they jammed too easily. I’ve tested other air rifles that have a similar repeating system, and that was my experience, as well. That must mean that the repeating version of the 68-XP is very rare because few were ever sold.
Back to the 300. According to the ARH catalog, a broken-in 300 should shoot about 665 f.p.s., and one that’s been accurized gets up to 680 f.p.s. They don’t mention what pellet was used in testing to obtain these numbers; but given that it was the 1970s, we know it had to be a lead pellet. Lead-free pellets were not on the market at that time.
Velocity testing
The first pellet I tested was the 7.9-grain Crosman Premier. They averaged 503 f.p.s. for 10 shots. The velocity ranged from 490 f.p.s. to 511 f.p.s., so a 21 f.p.s. spread.
I thought that was low, so I tried 10 more that were deep-seated with the Air Venturi Pellet Pen and Seater. This time, the average rose to 506 f.p.s., which is hardly worth the effort. The spread went from 496 f.p.s. to 519 f.p.s., so the spread opened to 23 f.p.s. Deep-seating doesn’t seem to be worth the time and effort with this rifle.
The next pellet I tested was the 7-grain RWS Hobby. These averaged 539 f.p.s. The Hobby was the lightweight lead speed demon of its day, so this rifle is not performing to spec. And yes, I did oil the leather piston seal before testing. The spread for Hobbys was from 524 to 547 f.p.s., so 23 f.p.s.
The final pellet I tested was the 7.33-grain Air Arms Falcon. They averaged 519 f.p.s. with a spread from 510 to 523 f.p.s. So the spread was only 13 f.p.s. Falcons fit the breech loosely, where the other two pellets fit snugly.
Breech seal
That puts today’s test into perspective. I don’t think my test rifle has been shot very much, if at all, because it doesn’t have the bluing wear that’s usually found on guns that have been used, and the bluing is original. I looked at the breech seal, which looked okay, but it’s very difficult to tell by just looking. There was no puff of air to be felt at the breech, but sometimes that isn’t conclusive, either.
While the seal looks like an o-ring, it’s really a tall synthetic seal that’s proprietary. When I removed it, I could see that nothing I could make would work as well, so I made a spacer to fit under it, raising it for a tighter fit.
The breech seal (right) and the plastic shim I made to fit under it to raise it higher at the breech.
I made the breech seal spacer from a coffee can lid by using hole punches.
Re-testing velocity
The spacer did increase velocity a little. Premiers went from an average of 503 to an average 522 f.p.s., and the spread that had been 21 f.p.s. dropped to 15 f.p.s. Hobbys went from 539 to 568 f.p.s., and the spread went from 23 f.p.s down to 15 f.p.s. Falcons jumped from an average 519 f.p.s. to 553, and the spread that had been 13 f.p.s. dropped to 6 f.p.s.
While these are all improvements, I don’t think they’re large enough to warrant the work that was done. I would leave the rifle where it is; but now that the spacer is in place, I won’t remove it.
Cocking effort
I measured the cocking effort on my bathroom scale. It topped out at 19 lbs., making the 300 a youth rifle by my criteria of a cocking effort of 20 lbs. or less. But the large size of the rifle means that it is for older kids or adults.
Trigger-pull
The trigger was releasing at 3 lbs., 2 oz., with the second stage being very creepy. I adjusted the one screw behind the trigger in both directions. Turned all the way in (clockwise), the first stage is removed entirely, and the pull remained where it was. Turned out as far as it will go, the first stage becomes light and stops positively at stage two. Stage two releases at 2 lbs., 14 oz., so a 4-oz. decrease from where it was.
The rifle is now ready for 10-meter accuracy testing. I may do something about the narrow rear sight notch so I can see some light around either side of the front post. If I do, I’ll tell you and show you what I do.
How the blog changed my life
I initially published this section on the May 30, 2014, blog. I’m going to repeat it at least once a week during June and July so it doesn’t get lost or forgotten.
From the comments many of you make, I believe the blog may have positively impacted your lives. I invite you to send me an email telling me about that impact.
Were you a firearms shooter who accidentally discovered airguns through this blog? If so, tell me how this blog has helped your understanding of airguns.
Were you already an airgunner, but you thought what you saw in the big box stores was all there was? If so, how has this blog helped you understand more about airguns?
I’ve gotten quite a few responses already, but I want to make sure you know that I’m not looking for “attaboys,” pats on the back or personal recognition. I’m looking for real feedback on what you’ve learned so I can target my blogs to what you feel is important, what you’d like to know and what you’re still unsure of. This blog is written for its readers, and I want to share your stories with others who may be where you were before you found this blog.
Pyramyd AIR has created a special temporary email address for this. I’ll be the only person to get these emails, and we’re not going to generate any lists from the addresses.
My plan is to publish one or more blog reports with the more interesting comments. If you want, I will use your real name or blog handle; but you can be anonymous, too. I won’t use your name or handle unless you give me written permission to do so.
This email address will be live for only a few weeks. We have tens of thousands of readers worldwide. Even if you’ve never commented on the blog, you can email me your message if you like. If you’re reading this blog after July 2014, email submissions will no longer be forwarded to me, and you may get an auto-reply email stating that or your email might bounce back to you.
Wow! just extracting that breech seal in one piece alone must’a been a chore.No pictures of the breech it came from? Always curious about new guns, and old ones too for that matter. Sounds like you gotta nice trigger to work with, always a plus!
Hi BB, Funny that the El Gamo 300 should come up now. I just bought a well used one and am trying to get it back up to speed. You might want to look for a hole in the back of the trigger guard on yours. Mine has that and a second trigger adjusting screw is accessed there. That screw will adjust the sear contact. I sourced a new breech seal from Chambers and am working on changing the leather seal to a synthetic parachute seal, or possibly an o-ring piston seal. Have to get rid of the rust and roughness in the compression tube first. I will follow up with my results.
Take care, Tom
Cool, Even more trigger adjustment And a power upgrade! Sweet!
Tom,
I’ll look for that!
B.B.
Tom,
Any plans to test the Daisy 74?
J.
J.,
I think I promised to review the 74 for someone. Was that you?
I have done a lot of BB guns recently, so if I do review it I want to give it some time for other topics to be run. I still have a couple BBs guns left to test right now.
B.B.
The first I knew about the Daisy 74 was when I saw it in the PA catalog I got in the mail today. However it looked interesting. So I figured I’d ask if a review was in the works to see if it was worth considering or not.
As for who you promised the review to… Wasn’t me. Though that still leaves the question of who it was.
I liked how after you put your shim spacer in it tightened up the velocity spread. Only 6 fps with the Falcons. That should make for some accurate shooting. I think I’m going to give a vote right now for the Falcons as the accuracy winner when the time comes. Now I can’t wait to see what happens with the accuracy test.
And I got to ask this question after the other day when we were talking about being spoiled about the accuracy of the new airguns that are out now days.
Back in the 60’s and 70’s when I was a kid and these type of guns were around. Was people shooting these guns out to 50 yards or farther? From what I remember when I was a kid at that time I would say my farthest shot was probably 40 yards with a air gun. With most of the shots taken in between 15 to 30 yards.
I know with the air guns that I have now days that if I shoot at a starling that is 40 to 60 yards out it will be done. And sparrows can even be hit at 50 yards when I’m doing my part.
Next question. What will be the next thing to happen to improve the accuracy of air guns? The mechanics,the barrels,the pellets. That’s what I would like to know. Kind of like the NP2. Or is there some other types of pellets being developed. Some different type of barrel design like the FX smooth twist barrels. What will happen to make the air guns more accurate. Or is what we have right now going to be it?
Gf1,
No, in the past people did not shoot pellet guns as far as we shoot them today.
Great bunch of questions! You inspired this Thursday’s blog!
Thanks,
B.B.
BB
I will be waiting for that blog. I think that should be a interesting subject. And thank you.
I’d have to go with pellet & packaging design .I’ve got about 30 lbs of lead saved up right now! 😉
Reb
Gunfun
I can remember back in the days of hunting on the islands in FL that most of my shots were also in the 15 to 30 yard range with an occasional shot at a raccoon or other large bird or mammal out at 40 and fifty yards with my 1400. It had to be a larger animal so you would have more area to aim at to allow for pellet drop, I would also pump my 1400 up to 12 to 14 times to give it enough punch to get out that far. Air guns have definitely come a long way since we were kids.
GF have you heard about the Air Ordinance 22 cal machine gun, it fire 22 pellets at 12 per second from a 100 round flexible clip in a drum on a 20 oz CO2 bottle or can be used with HPA. On CO2 it shoots at 600 fps and one of the reviewers stated that with some minor tweaks on HPA he got 760 fps, but he also said any more than that and the plastic clip started to get pinched in the breach because the air pressure was pushing the pellets out so fast it was pushing the clip forward also. It sells for 599.99, but you can fire 100 rounds in about 20 seconds and is way cool. Go to air-ordinance.com to see it. I need to have one. I don’t know about the next step of progress in air guns but the 22 machine gun is definitely one in the right direction if you ask me.
You got any farther on your 60C yet.
BB
Do you think you would be able to do a review on the air ordinance machine gun some time in the future.
Buldawg
Buldawg,
I already wrote a feature article about it for Shotgun News several years ago. Probably not going to review it here because Pyramyd AIR decided not to carry it. $500 is a lot to pay for a CO2 gun.
B.B.
BB
Can I go to their site and find it or would you by chance have a link to it. I have checked it out on the air ordinance site and read the 4 or 5 reviews but as you and me know they will always show the favorable reviews. I know you would do an honest evaluation of it.
Buldawg
Buldawg,
No. That was a Shotgun News article. They might have it, though it is a couple years old, so I doubt it.
I liked the gun overall, but loading was fiddly and it wasn’t very accurate.
B.B.
BB
it had to be fun to be able to rip out 100 rounds in a few seconds though. I probably could not afford the amount of pellets it would go thru though. it would be similar to a Umarex steel storm or Drozd blackbird I would suspect.
I will look at shotgun news for you article.
Buldawg
buldawg
I left a reply on the blog about the Shammal.
But I ended up turning the .177 cal. berrel down. It went in the 2240 Sunday. Its working great.
Im going to use the .22 cal. barrel in my FDAG with the Disco valve. I think the barrels are matched up to the two guns power supply better that way.
And I will check out that website later when Im at lunch tonight.
Gunfun
Glad to hear you got the barrel turned down and it fits and shoots good. I think you will like the 22 barrel in the FDAR gun better also. He helped you drink the beer also you should have told him it was BYOB. Haven’t made it out to sight it in at 50 yards yet, my grandson had his tonsils and adenoids out Friday so were are keeping him for a couple weeks. Spent 10 hours on my feet Thursday getting my AR lower done and am just now getting my legs back under me, can’t do 10 hours on my feet anymore that’s for sure.
It will be a couple weeks before I can get it sighted at 50 yards, I did find at my backyard range it does not like wadcutters, with CP domed and hollow points it hit right on target at 10 meters, but when I switched to some old daisy wadcutters it was hitting 1 1/2 to 2 inches high consistently.
got to stay with a domed or pointed pellets for sure. besides I won’t be hunting with wadcutters any way. Hope you get your disco valve secured and gun put back together so you can enjoy it.
Buldawg
buldawg
I did tell him to BYOB and he did. And we took care of that too. Besides what he braught for me. 🙂
Gunfun
Well that makes all the difference in the world then. He is a friend worth keeping
buldawg
That is too cool ! Are the 20oz CO2 bottles refillable, or is it a big time money pit ? I don’t know if I would put out the bucks for this gun, but it would certainly be a blast. Wow.
BB
It is a lot but it can also be run with HPA and there are many single shot PCP guns out there well over 500 bucks so I don’t think it is to far off price wise for a true 22 pellet machine gun. I know I could justify spending that amount of money on it versus a marauder or air arms condor or talon that are only repeaters not autos. That just my opinion and desire because I will never spend the money nor be subjected to the feds scrutiny of me to have a license for a real machine gun. Big brother is to deep into our lives already without opening the door and inviting them in.
Buldawg
I know you already know the answer to the accuracy question. If you look at some guns of the days starting with FWB 124/127 its technology was long weak spring with long cocking stroke then the TX200 short barrel with no spring load and now the Walter LGV.. I bet we all have ideas how to improve air guns.. The hard part is to start finding someone to make one for us..
Hopefuly somebody out there is listening and we will see more interesting things developed with air guns in mind.
GF1,
Believe me, they do listen. I hear myself quoted in meetings I have with them and in their booths at the SHOT Show all the time. They all read this blog and all the comments. That’s why I talk so openly.
B.B.
BB
Thats good. That is what I hope happens.
B.B.,
Off-Topic, but in the interest of keeping alive here the subject of the legendary M1 Carbine (and, I’ll admit, the subject of a CO2, lead pellet firing replica that I hope is in development somewhere in an Umarex facility), here is a kinda cool page on a version of the M1 carbione in PISTOL form!
A firearm that looks like a death ray gun from Buck Rogers: http://rareantiqueandbeautifulfirearms.tumblr.com/post/52692853929/prototype-or-inventors-model-30-caliber-carbine
WILD. It’s hard to believe the suits in Washington didn’t go for this.
Michael
Michael,
That’s one of the coolest pistols I’ve ever seen. Almost makes me want to own one!
Edith
Michael,
I don’t get surprised very often, but this is a prototype pistol I never knew existed before today. Good show!
B.B.
Michael
That is a cool looking pistol for sure. On the subject I believe that Winchester is now making a M1 replica that is CO2 powered. I believe I saw it on gunbroker.com in the air rifle category of the drop down browser. Check it out ,you can also do a search for M1 and it should bring it up.
Buldawg
Buldawg,
Might you be referring to the Winchester (airgun-wise really Daisy these days, RWS/Diana if it is vintage) MP4 or M14? Both have been around for a year or more, and both are cool, but despite some cosmetic similarities, the M14 is not the same thing as an M1 Carbine, and the MP4 is no M1. MP4 is more accurate, but infinitely less — well — let’s just say infinitely LESS.
OK, a warning. I’m about to wax nostalgically about the Greatest Generation, folks who actually DID save the world. The M1 Carbine is in my mind THE D-Day rifle (or, as it was usually wielded by paratroopers, the Day-Before-D-Day rifle). I understand it is perhaps underpowered and generally acknowledged as not terribly accurate, but it is to many folks who grew up playing with WWII-era plastic army men one of the coolest of “cool guy” guns. It is right there with the classic flintlock rifle and pistol, percussion cap revolvers by Colt and Remington, single-action revolvers by Colt, lever-action rifles, Thompson machine guns, 1911A1s, S&W Model 29s, Colt Pythons, Mac10s, and so on. Coooool.
Back to the M1 Carbine. Think “Band of Brothers,” the excellent HBO miniseries. Those soldiers were proto-Special Ops, proto-Airborne soldiers who dropped from static lines at indeterminate altitudes in most cases less than 1000 feet! They hit the ground in total darkness in rural occupied Western Europe, and they hit it HARD and without the ability to see it coming up at them. Most (maybe all, I’m the son of an historian but not one myself) carried four essentials: a little clicking device that sounded like a cricket on steroids to signal to other paratroopers in the dark, a canteen, a sheath knife with a leather wrapped handle, and a (folding) wire-stocked M1 Carbine.
This was a day or so BEFORE the Normandy landings. They were The Allies’ head start, before the official Allied invasion on the French coast of Normandy. (Watch “The Longest Day” or “Saving Private Ryan” for that story, both absolute must-sees.) The D-Day soldiers carried a number of different rifles, I suppose, but key was the other M1 — the M1 Garand, often regarded as the greatest rifle of all time. That was semiauto and accurate but also big and heavy.
The Allied paratoopers needed a semiauto that was light and compact, hence the M1 Carbine.
Michael
Michael
I agree that a M14 or MP4 is definitely not a M1 and as far as nostalgia goes you have not offended me in any way. I am not old enough to have served in WWII, but my father did serve as an Air Force B-26 bomber copilot in both WWII and the Korean war. While he did not fight head on the ground as a grunt. He has told me several stories of the B-26 he was flying barely making it back to the base due to having numerous holes and one and some times two engines not working. he said he really did not like to talk about it much , but as a young kid I guess I would not let him suffer in silence mas I was very intrigued about our history and how we won WWII so I kept on him until he would tell me some of his missions.
I think it actually helped him some also to be able to the burden of what all our brave men went through. He was not on the ground ,but that by no means takes away any of the grief or sadness that our men all felt when fellow soldiers were lost. There were many a B-26 that did not come back home as well as members of his crew that lost their lives in combat with fighter planes. I do remember his parachute knife and canteen and the other items he always had on him when on a mission as I still have the knife, canteen, duffel bags and footlocker that he was issued.
Yes the M1 is one of the coolest of all the military weapons ever made. I do own a model 1911 that was carried by an infantry soldier by the name of Campbell Perkins in WW1. It was picked up by a friends father along with the old style Calvary holster off his dead body. I have traced the serial number to it being one of 5000 made in 1914 by Springfield armory. There is no amount of money that would get me to sell it as it is a tribute to what our country has endured and accomplished by the brave soldiers that gave us our freedom we have today. I also have a Dirty Harry Special Smith & Wesson model 29 that was bought in 1977 when they were all hand made and fitted by Smith & Wesson, you can barely slide a sheet of paper between the cylinder and barrel on it. It is another gun that no amount of money will take it from my possession.
There are way more guns I would like to have than I will ever afford, but never stop dreaming.
Buldawg
Just a small comment… Just mentioning “M1” is ambiguous… The .30 M1 Carbine is a much different weapon from the M1 Garand… And neither should be confused for the M1A (which is a semi-auto only version of the selective-fire M14).
Michael
I was wrong about Winchester making a CO2 M1, but they do make a CO2 M14 that is very similar to an M1. Here is the link to the gun broker page for the M14.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=420965895
Don’t know if its what you were talking about or not but it looks very much the same as a M1.
Buldawg
Buldawg,
And here is my test:
/blog/2012/07/winchester-m14-177-caliber-dual-ammo-air-rifle-part-3/
B.B.
B.B.,
Bah!
Once again I took too long to compose and did not post quickly enough. I wasn’t inaccurate about your conclusions, however. ;^)
Michael
Buldawg,
Yep, see my comment above. I do not have one of those M14s, but the M14 was based on the M1 Carbine, obviously, and B.B. did a report on that air rifle. As I recall he found it to be very accurate for its price and fun to shoot for its price. in other words, a very good, fun, affordable plinker.
And a classic BB gun of the past is the Crosman M1, which came out in three versions over time, the first wood version, the light colored “Croswood” (i.e. plastic, but a decent one) version, and for a brief time a dark Croswood variant. I have one of the middle, most common, I think, variants, light colored plastic. The wood ones have the advantage of being wood, but the plastic ones are better in my opinion because it is a heavy plastic, and the plastic ones are much more contoured than the more slab-like wood ones.
Still, the Crosman M1 is a BB shooting, smoothbore repeater, not a CO2 powered, lead pellet shooting, rifled barreled, semiauto (or even faux/ersatz semiauto) long airgun.
Oh man. I just got too worked up about a potential airgun / airgun concept again. I have one of each of Umarex’ Walther Lever Action rifles, a 2×12 gram full size black, short size black, and Wells Fargo, and a 90 gram stainless look one. I also have the Umarex lead pellet 1911A1, Desert Eagle, and Beretta 92FS pistols. All use the interchangeable and proven Umarex 8 shot metal circular magazine. These are all light-triggered, smooth cycling, reliable, accurate airguns. Yeah, that is a LOT of pellet guns, but because all are well-designed, well-made, and shoot well, and because I now have a zillion of those little metal 8 shot Umarex magazines, I have not parted with any of them, even though my bank balance would be bigger if I did so. Every one of them is a good shooter, so for now, I keep them all.
What I have in my daydreams is a pellet-shooting, rifled barreled, 8-shot circular magazine, CO2 powered M1 Carbine from Umarex. I do not care if it uses one 12 gram CO2, or two 12 gram CO2s, or one 90 gram CO2. It must be all metal and wood.
I will pay a Walther Lever Action price for it (might have to sell the Beretta 92FS) because I understand the realities of business. Everyone must make money or it will not happen (might have to sell the Wells Fargo,too). That is capitalism. Love capitalism or . . . well, uh, if you want to leave capitalism, in 2014 you can either move to North Korea and starve, or you can step off an airplane into the Amazon basin (which I once actually DID — I came back) and, well, you won’t starve, but I assure you your diet will change dramatically.
I desire what would be a very special air rifle, and I understand that in order for it to happen, it will not be $100, or $200, or $300. The end-user, “street” price ought to be between $400 and $450, if the airgun is all metal/wood, etc.
So, I am still hoping, daydreaming, looking to the gods of European airgun manufacturing, and so forth.
Michael
Michael
I feel your pain brother, I too have several air guns that I cannot get rid of even if I would have to hunt every day just to survive. I have a original bought by me in 1968 crosman 1400 22 cal pumper that I have upgraded with a new crosman steel breach and discovery 24 inch barrel because the original barrel has no rifling left in it, did not modify the gun to fit the new breach and barrel I modified the new breach and used a old metal 760 front barrel band. Got a backpacker 22 with 18 inch barrel, Daisy Avanti 853, new style 760 for grand son, Xisico XC60C PCP in 22 and a couple B3s. I would have more but out of work now waiting for disability due to health .
I have way more firearms than air guns but always looking for deals, I just can never stop buying cause one day most likely sooner than we all would like guns, ammo, bullets, food ,water, cogs, wood, gas, and so on will be what we use to survive by bartering and trading because or dollar will be no good except to start a fire with. This sure ain’t the country I grew up in anymore and it is only going to get worse before it gets better, the only question is how much worse, Prepare for the worst and Hope for the best are words I live by now.
Buldawg
Invest in ammo..
Chris
Can you even buy it anymore in CT after sandy hook, CT is like one of the worst states for gun rights next to DC and NY. Got to clean house come NOV and get rid of all the idiots in DC. Life,Liberty ,and the Pursuit of Happiness have long been forgotten in DC instead it disarm the cattle and round em up to make slaves for the gov’t. United WE Stand, Divided We Fall.
Buldawg
buldawg
I finally got to check out that website with the air ordinance machine gun. And I thought I recognized that name. I almost bought one of them.
You know why I didn’t. And after I tell ya you will know I’m getting lazy in my old age. I didn’t feel like loading all them pellets everytime that I would shoot it. Heck I got single shot trays in my Marauder rifles just because I hate taking the time loading them instead of shooting. And think about that if you go to a range that you have to pay by the hour. (better have a bunch of magazines on hand and loaded up already) And yes I was lucky enough to get a .25 cal. tray back when they still sold them for the .25 Marauders. And that is the only thing that I don’t like about the semi-auto Monsoon is loading the magazines. But it does make it all up when you start pulling the trigger and popping off shots as fast as you can pull the trigger.
And you can’t get the single shot trays for the .22 or .25 cal. Marauder rifles anymore. I still don’t understand why they dropped them.
Gunfun
It would be a pain loading the 100 round belt for sure, but I think the reward of firing those 100 pellets would be worth it. BB said he did a article for shot gun news on it and he did state loading the belts was fiddly and it wasn’t that accurate. I will never own a real machine gun due to all the red tape required to own it legally so the pellet version would satisfy that same need.
Here is a true story about my youngest son and his sticky fingers when he was fifteen. We live In cocoa Fl at the time and took a trip up to Pell City Al to visit my wife’s family. We had gone over to Birmingham to visit the wife’s sister and her husband, he was a paranoid gun nut and had a automatic weapons license. he had guns behind doors and laying at various places through out the house. One was a Mac 10 that was in the Styrofoam case laying in the bottom of a book case in the living room. Well my son having the sticky fingers he did managed to get it out of the house and into the back floorboard of our car with a pillow placed over it. The visit with her family ended and we went back home to FL. My youngest son was always getting in trouble for various things and about two weeks after our visit he had gotten suspended from school for threatening a teacher. So in the process of talking and disciplining him he went in to his bedroom and came back out with the Mac 10 threatening to kill us both if we did not leave him alone. Needless to say I got the gun from and asked where did he get it from. His story was that some guy came by the local movie theater where all the kids hung out and gave it to him, of course I did not believe that and tried to get him to tell me the truth and he stuck to that story. Now not really believing the story, but also if buy some slim chance that it was true I knew that I needed to let the cops know. So off to the police station I went with it a paper bag,(my neighbor across the street was a captain on the police force) and when I got there and asked to see the chief of police and they lead me back to his office. I explained the situation to him as my son had stated and set the bag on his desk and backed away for him to look in the bag. When he pulled pout the Mac 10 his eyes almost popped out of their sockets ( this was in 1982). and he definitely said they would look into the situation. I went over to my neighbor the captain on the force and asked him to let me know who the gun belonged to when they got the serial numbers on it run and he came over the next day and told me who the gun was registered to, it was my wife’s sisters husband. Needless to say he has a long conversation with the ATF as to how a fifteen year old was able to get his hands on the gun and lost his auto permit ( no jail time ). I was so mad at my son because if he had told me the truth about where he got the gun I would be the owner of a Mac 10 today. My wife’s sisters husband was abusive and we believe to this day that he caused her to commit suicide from the abuse. I would have not turn that gun in to the police if I had only known the truth.
It does not make sense why crosman would discontinue the single shot trays unless they did not sell enough to make it worth the cost to make. it good to know though because I have been considering a 25 cal marauder in the future when my disability get approved.
Buldawg
buldawg
That was a a heck of a story. And I’m not sure which way I would of went about that situation. And you know the outcome always could of turned out worse.
And about the air ordinance gun. I like the gun. And I only have one bb gun and that’s a Steel Storm and its a fun gun and I have seriously thought about one of those Drozd Blackbirds with some modifications. At least the bb’s can be dumped into a spot and not have to be loaded one by one.
And if I know myself if I pick up a automatic pellet or bb gun I’m going to have the trigger buried all the time. I don’t think I would be taking single shots. Matter of fact I don’t know if the single fire selector on my Steel Storm even works. That’s been on burst mod since I got it.
But the air ordinance is definitely cool and at least its another option available so you can have a automatic firing pellet gun. I know some people favor the pellet versions of guns over bb’s and well the other way around also. So with the air ordinance gun shooting pellets those people can be happy also.
And what ever reason it was that Crosman stopped making the single shot tray’s for the .22 and .25 cal. marauder rifles is beyond me. But now I wish I would of bought a few extra anyway. I don’t guess they should ever break. But I hope I don’t have to go back to the magazines. Well will see in time I suppose.
Gunfun
Yea my son could have been charged with grand theft, but I think the brother in law had more problems dealing with the ATF than worrying about filing charges. I not even sure he was told who took the gun because I never spoke to him afterwards at all.
The only thing I have against the steel storm or blackbird is that BBs ricochet way to easy so you have to have a absorbing type back stop, where as the pellets don’t tend to ricochet as much, they still do some. I know I would be like you and it would never be put on single shot mode. BBs are definitely less expensive than pellets and I am not sure I could afford the pellets to shoot it with. Right now with my g-kids and me shooting in the backyard the pellets are getting deep into my small budget.
I am on the fence over the Marauder versus the Hatsan AT 44. I am waiting for BBs further reviews of the Hatsan. I will keep my eye out on ebay and gunbroker for a single shot tray for the marauder for sure.
buldawg
That’s kind of why I don’t have bb guns is because of the ricochets. I myself think bb guns should be used with traps or used outside in an open field. But you still got to watch for the dang things bouncing off of the object your shooting at sometimes.
Gunfun
Yea I agree with the BB thing about ricochets. that’s also why I mainly have pellet guns sans my lonely P08 I got for a deal at a flea market, it is fun to shoot but you got watch for the ricochets. I remember when I was a kid having bb gun fights with all my friends and its a wonder” We did not shoot our eye out” LOL.
Buldawg
Michael, the m14 was based on the m1 Garand, not the m1 carbine. Zimbabwae ed
Thanks for that info. The resemblance to the carbine is so strong, I carelessly assumed. What is the old saying, “Don’t assume because . . . ” (family friendly blog).
Michael